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Post by Tout-Perd on Sept 30, 2015 12:34:26 GMT -5
Hey guys, your trusty admin here. Thought I should make a thread to address the idea of a "Soft Reboot" of RP that cropped up on the Facebook group.
To answer the big questions: -Essentially everything that happened in ORP still happened, going waaay back. The only major differences are that the cities have new names, and broad strokes are being used to skip over some of the material that we don't really have the rights to use. Authors are free to use this to tweak the names and backstories of their casts as they would like. -We're doing this for two reasons: Firstly, so that we can begin publishing (tidied up) roleplays as eBooks and maybe start doing story compilations and such. I actually have a few friends and contacts in the publishing industry who can get me some good deals, so publishing an actual paper-and-ink story collection set in the Archipelago is not out of the question for us. This isn't for a profit, but rather, that we may share our stories with the world at large. -Secondly, this streamlining will make the setting much easier for newcomers to understand and jump into. Leaving Role Play open ended for ANY concept was nice, but it also meant that newcomers felt like they needed grounding in Pokemon, Animorphs, Godzilla, Final Fantasy, DBZ, and Bleach just to understand what was going on at all, in addition to understanding years of unique canon. Rebuilding things and streamlining them will let newbies read through a page of city descriptions and maybe a single timeline, and have them almost entirely ready to jump into a more centralized setting. -There's been several votes on the matter to date, and as far as I know, every active member except BloodWolf, Kara, and I think one other person are supporting the idea. That said, I'd like discussion with those not in favor; it's easy to get carried away with doing new things and throw the baby out with the bathwater. I want vigilance, to ensure that while we change the "skin" of the setting, the heart remains the same.
That said, the changes within my own cast: -Zebedee Taylor, Natalie, Helen, and Thyra never were Pokemon trainers. Zebedee's position as a gymleader was probably instead some other position of public trust, like part of the City legislature or the like. -Zebedee never went by Lee. That's just dumb. -Miko and Maude's summons that are trademarks of Toho will be... altered. That means Mogu, Bagan, Dogolas, Ayg, and so forth will be cut, with fitting substitutes given that will fill those roles.
And that's all the changes within my own cast. Anybody else have anything to contribute?
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Shoni
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Post by Shoni on Sept 30, 2015 13:43:32 GMT -5
I think we need to organize everything into an official Cannon, timeline, and map for the archipelago. This should be one of our first tasks because I've been part of this for almost 6 years and I still have very little knowledge about the setting overall.
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Post by Loogs on Sept 30, 2015 13:48:26 GMT -5
I think we need to organize everything into an official Cannon, timeline, and map for the archipelago. This should be one of our first tasks because I've been part of this for almost 6 years and I still have very little knowledge about the setting overall. i mean in my experience here you don't have to know like, everything, we used to keep guides like character profiles, powers, etc etc but now we're all Adults with Real Life Responsibilities we hardly have time to even write anymore let alone try and compile 10+ years worth of canon scattered across three boards and hundreds of members? i am interested in this reboot, i thought it was something that had already happened tbh but i've been away for a while [sips soda] whats new yall what did i miss
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SV
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Post by SV on Sept 30, 2015 15:48:58 GMT -5
I think we need to organize everything into an official Cannon, timeline, and map for the archipelago. This should be one of our first tasks because I've been part of this for almost 6 years and I still have very little knowledge about the setting overall. Dude I've been around since like...WAYYY back. Not the first iteration of Pokeschool but close to it. And I still hardly have any idea about the setting overall. So yeah, I'm 110% in support of this and willing to help in whatever meager ways I may be able to. What are some of the arguments from the dissenters? B-dubbs, Kara? Just curious. P.S. An official map/timeline is The Best Thing I Have Heard in a While.
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Post by AngelicTragedy on Sept 30, 2015 16:19:14 GMT -5
Sweet summer children. Bulbs and myself have been around for nearly two decades and I can speak from experience when I say that setting has never been a major point of concern. We've always used a setting idea for our own needs and nothing more.
Now, if we're really going to do this, we have to do it right. I know there have been several skype conversations about it but I think the conversation needs to be made public if we are to continue. As far as timelines go, we can for sure get something roughed out between Lee, Bulbs, Choobs, and myself since we have been the longest, somewhat active, members that have been in just about every super major storyline.
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Post by Lady Kara on Sept 30, 2015 18:08:12 GMT -5
A bit thankful at this point that a lot of my stuff (Nintaku and other denizens of mine from Emerra, Drakyan Elves, etc.) are unique enough to not be an issue, but some of my major characters (Kara T-K, Serpentei, Sagami, and Ayane) have been deeply rooted in the Pokemon universe since back when I joined Pokeschool in 1999. The entire Todoroki Islands were created in that universe, including Kamineko Island where the Tachikawa and Kinkaryoh families live/work and the home of my fakemon (most wellknown to ORP being Embrosia, the Dynalion... an evo of Persian). For example... Sagami, who relies a lot on pokemon both as dear comrades as well as for power (since he can't really use his Nintaku powers anymore due to his health being fucked over). I mean, I possibly could have him use mystical creatures instead for allies, but not sure how to recreate his buds like that and it feels strange. Also, since some of my stuff is in the Dark World/Emerra, that'd make it hard to be in an eBook due to that world being created by Salina Sachau, who isn't around anymore ("Chibi Vegeta" at Pokeschool, then "Sunlight Blacksmith" on other sites; I do, btw, have lots of her creations/world-lore written down in multiple text files from back when we tried having our own RP board). Getting rid of anything copyrighted would result in being like ripping out the heart of the ORP, in my opinion, even if a truly wonderful idea for the sake of letting our creations be enjoyed by the rest of the world. Because then we'd lose what inspired it all or what makes some characters special. At least in my case. Put it this way... not totally against the idea of a reboot, just that... I'd have 16 years worth of RP work and character development that'd end up no longer existing since most of them are so strongly tied to copyrighted material (Pokemon, DBZ, etc.). It hurts to think about changing all that stuff so dramaticly after years of writing and rewriting all the info (some of which you guys have never even seen since I keep it in a notebook for my own personal reference while RPing; hell, even some story arcs have background info that never got used yet... like in "Mirror of Urakuni").
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Post by AngelicTragedy on Sept 30, 2015 19:37:09 GMT -5
Changing the source material really isn't so much of a big deal no matter how deeply rooted a toon is in another universe. With a few simple changes of names and small concepts, it can literally change everything without changing the root of a character.
For instance, Bulbs has Sly the Andolite who is literally an Animorphs rip. Slightly change the species description and name and you have a new race that can be expanded on. DBZ can be fighting with magic or some form of aura (ie Valon's abilities) along side the fighting aspect. Pokemon can be turned into unique animal companions with abilities based on elemental magics or physical power.
It's far more constructive for the RP to shift now and not have to worry about the possible copyright issues than not. Truth be told it should have been done a long time ago.
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Post by Hamuu on Sept 30, 2015 22:24:34 GMT -5
This one is rough to weigh in on. On the one hand yeah make everything original content and see what we can do with it. But on the other I agree that some of this stuff is hard to gut. I mean Sly was equal parts animorphs and Pokemon. Rick has some original ideas but he is a walking Final Fantasy reference. Some characters will require massive shifts and others will not. Half of me wants to suggest closing the door on this rp and starting something new and original. Butwe've tried that at least twice not to mention how hard it is to walk away from 10 + years of a character. I really don't know where to place myself here. I meanwe'd have to rewrite swathes of the war for sure . Hum
That's all I've got for now
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Post by Tout-Perd on Sept 30, 2015 22:30:57 GMT -5
Sly honestly wouldn't be that hard to rework, at this point. His Pokemon are all gone (except Mew?), and after all, he is a shapeshifter, though admittedly heavily rooted in his whole Andalite deal. I'm not sure what would be preferable; having him mostly appear in human morph and just imply his alien nature, or coming up with a take on Andalite that's more your own deal. When I was talking with people about the school idea, I was kinda thinking he'd mostly appear human there, but would hint at his true form with partial morphs in such a way that would almost make him seem like an eldritch abomination to those who don't get the wink-and-nod Andalite (e.g. catching students acting up by sprouting eyestalks that look behind him, at some point when force is necessary, producing a bladed "tentacle" from somewhere etc.
As for rick, couldn't you just change the name his magic goes by? He seems like he isn't too tied up in lore.
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SV
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Post by SV on Sept 30, 2015 23:17:30 GMT -5
I mean, the issue is mostly the use of trademarked/copyrighted stuff. There's no reason that something couldn't be heavily, obviously influenced by [insert fandom here]. It would just require us to give them our own derivative-but-ultimately-original twist. (Of course, any of my LotR/Fire Emblem/Pokemon/etc. influenced characters have long long since been repressed and forgotten, so my opinion on this can be disregarded at your discretion.)
We could ostensibly create a paralleled ORP world reboot, leaving Old ORP (OORP) to continue as it is and whatever interested parties taking up in New ORP (NORP). But this would cause a lot of issues with continuity, and with the lack of activity we suffer from already, I don't think that we could support two simultaneous ORPs.
There is kind of something to be said for just a complete hard reset on ORP, but that is an awful lot of work and history to completely trash.
This comment is not actually helpful whatsoever.
[EDIT]: Awwwshit does anyone remember Wudge and praetoritevong from like way back in the day with their Jedi characters oh my god I just remembered.
[EDIT 2]: Hey, Post No. 2,222! *cheer*
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Post by Lady Kara on Sept 30, 2015 23:28:23 GMT -5
(Seriously miss Wudge... I used to talk to him on AIM a long time until I stopped using it; no idea what he's up to anymore)
Branching off my earlier comment, it's not that I -can't- change things, it's that it just feels weird after so many years.
Thankfully all things relating to DBZ are long phased out and unimportant, so no worries on that. If I seriously have to, though, could make the Pokemon in Todoroki be mystical creatures. But no idea what to call them since most of the ideas I have right now involve the word "kin" at the end (don't want anyone to think I ripped off Gaia Online, even though my term "Spirikin" was used a few times back when I was on Pokeschool). And if I need to distance my stuff from the land of Emerra (so not to infringe on Salina's work), that wouldn't be too hard since I already have another variation of Chikarakuni (Nintaku homeland) that was for a videogame idea that I came up with 5 years ago.
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Post by Tout-Perd on Oct 1, 2015 11:55:26 GMT -5
Right now, I wouldn't worry at all about distancing yourself from Emerra, since after all, that's another writer in our general group. I mean, if it came up in a plot we wanted to publish, we could always track Chibi Vegeta down. I never wrote with them, but they always seemed pretty chill, and I'm guessing if we asked "Hey, we're publishing some RPs, mind if we include a shoutout to your work?" They'd probably be pretty cool with it, though yeah, it definitely bears talking with them.
And yeah, the thing that helps us with Fakemon is that Mons are a genre now, not a franchise. Back when we first started, having Pokemonlike creatures would make people go "Okay, so you're either Pokemon or Digimon." Now there's Pokemon, Digimon, Fossil Fighters, Monster Rancher, Yokai Watch, and dozens of others, so we get a lot more leeway. Honestly, there isn't much that takes changing.
The elephant in the room is PRP, in my opinion. PRP has been hinted to be a divergent timeline for quite some time (ever since Zebedee lost his party). I fully see PRP as maintaining all the history it has, though it really needs some more activity.
Ultimately, I think the key thing to be said is one can have all sorts of "ripped" stuff in backstory, but you can write in the present without having it be an issue. Like I'm pretty sure Sly spent his entire time on Luxury Airship Ride in human form, only implying his otherworldy roots, and I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure Mirror of Urakuni only had one or two passing mentions of Pokemon. These are things that don't need to be changed about the characters, ultimately. In fact, if we're doing any casual RPs that are just a lark (party roleplays, off the cuff more casual stuff, etc) I could fully see using the copyrighted stuff without any sort of issue, since it's unlikely we'd be trying to print "Sly spikes the punch with Andalite moonshine" on Amazon. XD
The really big changes with this retcon, tbh, is going to mostly involve doing a CTRL F find and replace of the names of cities (Ecruteak becomes Winstone, Slateport becomes Salcester) and a few key factions (I'm not sure what we'd call Team Rocket). Besides that, it's fine to leave the past as it is. I'm not planning on changing Kanto or Johto much beyond names, because that's where there's a lot of history. I am planning on gutting Hoenn and changing it a lot, but that's mostly because nothing of importance ever happened in Hoenn except for Miko going Bolshevik-Muppet on Slateport. So think less "My characters have to give up being trainers!" and think more like how in the old days, some RPers would request our trainer characters didn't bring Pokemon into specific plots. Heck, depending on how much you really want to change things, it could be entirely canon that the Todoroki Islands have a vibrant Pokemon population, it's just that it's wink-wink, nudge-nudge referred to as "mystical creatures" or "mutant animals" when the islands are mentioned by other characters in certain RPs.
(As for Sinnoh, Unova, etc, I think I'm going to leave them out. With just the first three regions, we have thirty five cities of note. That's arguably more than the continental United States. I think Sinnoh and so forth would just make things cluttered, and honestly, outside PRP, I've never seen anything relevant at all happen in the post-Hoenn regions.)
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Post by AngelicTragedy on Oct 1, 2015 12:13:32 GMT -5
It was my understanding that the change was only really implied for the ORP. As such I see PRP finally becoming its own fully fledged entity, which is long overdue.
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Post by Yoshimitsu on Oct 1, 2015 15:45:17 GMT -5
It was my understanding that the change was only really implied for the ORP. As such I see PRP finally becoming its own fully fledged entity, which is long overdue. Seconded - personally, my PRP characters have no relevance to my ORP characters apart from passing mentions. ORP and PRP Yoshimitsus are two separate characters, just like how ORP and PRP Zebedee are two different characters. I was gonna drop some of my own character change insights but I got distracted by my PS3 so maybe later.
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Post by Lady Kara on Oct 2, 2015 22:01:20 GMT -5
Okay... so glad that Salina left me enough data files to work with that it's not bad she isn't around anymore. Therefore, gonna keep all Emerra-related things but tweak some bits of my own (something I've needed to work on for a while since I've been finally cementing the details about the Nintaku and their homeland, besides other Emerra-landers of mine).
And to be honest, I technically have 2 different versions of Todoroki. There is the version that I first created back when I needed a place for Kara and her family to live, and then there's the version of it that I made for my own Pokemon League story (an actual videogame idea that uses all my fakemon). When coming up with backhistory info for my characters a few years ago (something that Steph was doing that involved a census-thingy), I began to realize that Pokemon don't fit the history of Todoroki that well and it'd work better if I used Spirikin instead (for various reasons... the biggest being that Spirikin are summoned via magical stones that can be set in armor and other objects, something more fitting for the samurai-like warriors of Todoroki's ancient past).
With that in mind, it'd actually be awesome if I revamped Kara and Serpentei's gym to be a Spirikin battle arena. Same goes with the big ancient one that Sagami is caretaker and champion of (keep it how he's more into battling that way, than traditional Nintaku combat as the rest of his family does most often). My characters remain the same, just no longer Pokemon be as a big a thing except for run-ins with them in the past (because hell no am I changing big things like that time where Kara was dead and Mewmassicre revived her with his fakemon Yncatia).
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