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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on May 29, 2014 13:11:12 GMT -5
Good golly do the factions in Oblivion suck. Every faction, with the exception of the Arena, can be summed up with "Group S is being destroyed by Entity T and only you can save it". The Blades; The Empire is being destroyed by Mehrunes Dagon and only you can save it! The Dark Brotherhood: The Dark Brotherhood is being destroyed by a traitor and only you can save it!. The Thieves Guild has Heironymous Lex making their lives Hell and coming close to stopping them, the Fighters Guild has the Blackwood Company taking all their work, the Mages Guild is being destroyed by Mannimarco. Even the expansions have this. Only you can stop Jyggalag from destroying the Shivering Isles (again) and The church needs you to save them from Umaril (though technically you're a separate organization, but you're so heavily tied to the church that it works).
I suppose you could make some argument for the main quest not actually needing YOU to save the world. Really, it needs Martin. However, Martin needs you (especially at the Kvatch segment of the game), so really it still comes down to YOU. Granted, to some extent that's inherent in games like this, how is the adventure epic if you're not needed for anything more than clearing out goblins? Well, that works for the main quest well enough, but do all the side stories need that?
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on May 31, 2014 16:42:52 GMT -5
I am now also convinced that Age of Empires II cheats. Horrendously so.
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Jun 3, 2014 12:15:06 GMT -5
Yeah... Oblivion would be an awkward place, if the player didn't exist. Speaking of something similar, I've recently read a discussion topic on /r/fallout about what would the Mojave Wasteland be like if the protagonist of the game died after he got shot at the beginning of the game. Fascinating stuff...especially, since you have to try to figure out where the certain factions would have succeeded and where they would have failed when looking at quests where you make things happen for that faction.
I suppose... How so? I mean, I have my own guesses in how the AI in RTSes has an incredibly unfair advantage, but... What are you referring to, specifically?
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jun 6, 2014 11:02:45 GMT -5
Oddly enough I can answer part of the question for Oblivion. Cyrodiil would have fallen, it seems like a huge amount of portals opened up there (in part just to eliminate Martin). Morrowind likely would have collapsed too, as they were hit pretty hard by the daedra and red mountain would have exploded, causing more trouble and making them easier prey. Skyrim may survive for a time, I could certainly see them defending the province for a time, especially since they have the best legion in the Empire at the time. Black Marsh would have survived until most, or all, of the other provinces had fallen. The Argonians were actually swarming into the portals and taking the fight directly to Mehrunes Dagon's forces, eventually causing them to close all the portals in Black Marsh just so they wouldn't be overrun. This would make them the safest province and probably cause tons of refugees to swarm to the place. Diseases would likely force their numbers to stay low, so it may not even strain resources.
Past that, I don't know. I have little to no information about the other provinces at that time. The Redguards have repeatedly been referred to as good solo fighters, but too independent to work in an army. High Rock has mages and orcs, but it never seemed to me to be all that united and may not be able to hold it's own. Valenwood and Eslweyr... I really couldn't say. And the lands of the Sload? Well, I'm not sure that we even really care what happens to them.
Naturally, with the whole of Tamriel falling apart, the Mages/Fighters Guilds would effectively cease to be. The Thieves Guild would probably stay active for a time, and the Dark Brotherhood would remain in power (since Sithis is important to Argonians).
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Jun 9, 2014 21:25:42 GMT -5
That leaves me curious, though. Sure, Cyrodiil would have fallen...but, would all the other parts of Tamriel have no chance of uniting to fight (sorry, if this was explained...it's been a while since I've played Oblivion)? If nothing else, since the Guilds seem to exist in every part of Tamriel, isn't there a possibility that they might form a Pact-style union to oppose a common enemy? Surely, they would see the long-term advantage of the increased memberships fueled by the fact that being as a part of one of the guilds will be seen as a noble (and, possibly even, prestigious) act? Also, this is the thread that I read the discussion in, talking about the alternative future of the Mojave Wasteland: Link.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jun 10, 2014 3:53:36 GMT -5
The problem is that the Oblivion Gates appeared in EVERY region of Tamriel that is part of the Empire. So all the areas were pretty much going to Hell and were being at least weakened, if not suffering crippling defeats, making it difficult for them to unify. You can actually see this happen on a smaller scale in Cyrodiil. In the Allies for Bruma quest you go to each of the cities and you seek help from them. They all tell you that they won't help until the Oblivion Gates have been closed. The Provinces wouldn't be able to unite to help each other out in this instance because they're all shouting about being attacked by daedra and can't help until the threat is gone. In fact, you can even get an idea for how poorly they're all doing during the Allies for Bruma quest. You're sent to talk to Chancellor Ocato to request Legion aid. He tells you that they're all tied up in the provinces and that his generals swear that they can't spare any legions for Cyrodiil itself. Another dire fact appears when you realize that the daedra are attacking military strongholds.
When you look at Kvatch, you can tell that it should be a very defensible area. It's not just on a plateau, past the walls it's almost a sheer drop. Then you have the walls itself, and the gates. If I recall correctly, Kvatch's gates are the only ones that are made out of solid steel and they employ complex mechanisms to open the gates. Past that Castle Kvatch is well fortified as well, with easily defensible walls and a moat to keep intruders out. These are defenses that even the Imperial City can't boast that. The next city we really hear about is Ald'ruhn. Ald'ruhn is no where near as defensible as Kvatch (which should be able to hold off a good sized army for a good length of time), but it does have some walls and several towers to guard it, as well as Fort Buckmoth to aid in its defense. On top of that, the Redorans are no slouches at fighting and it happened to hold a Redoran Council within its walls. The final place that we know fell to the daedra was the Crystal Tower in the Summerset Isles. While not a city, strictly speaking, it was a very important place to the Altmer and was the center of magical learning before the Mages Guild was founded. I don't know if it was still being used for magical purposes or not, but it strikes me that it likely was to some extent. If nothing else its destruction would likely have caused a crippling blow to the Altmer (I do at least know that it was a refugee center during the Oblivon Crisis when it fell). When you add all this up, it looks like the daedra targeted several critical locations that would have made their campaign easier and dealt a crippling blow to their enemies.
As to the guilds, if they're getting recruits that have an inkling of what they're doing then they may stand a chance and could potentially reach out to each other, so long as the Mages Guild could perform some kind of magical communication. If they can't, or if the guilds are getting worthless members, then they'd be on their own and may be of little use to the overall defense of the provinces. I think the biggest concern there would lie in Skyrim and Hammerfell. Neither of them trust sorcery much.
I don't know about Hammerfell, but Skyrim doesn't have either the Mage's Guild, or the Fighter's Guild. The College of Winterhold may have been of some use though, since it's an independent magical group. As to The Companions, I don't know if their ranks would have swelled or not, the taste of them we get in Skyrim seems to indicate that they'll only accept certain people that fit some somewhat unknown criteria, plus it doesn't have chapter-houses, just one hall in Whiterun. To their benefit, Skyrim does have the best legion around, and presumably some of the best battlemages to match. If not then they could have supplement their lack of magical ability with the college and could potentially attempted a more coordinated effort.
As to Hammerfell, I don't know if they have either a Fighter's Guild or Mage's Guild. If they do have a Fighter's Guild of sorts then it likely would work to their benefit more than a Legion force would, since Redguard's are such capable fighter's on an individual level. Still, their lack of magical abilities would likely cripple their ability to work with anyone on a coordinated level.
As to "Pact-style union to oppose a common enemy", in some ways it seems like the Empire itself was supposed to fulfill this role. I think the biggest obstacle it faced to that is that the daedra hit everywhere at once, just about literally, so they couldn't put forth a unified force to take on the enemy. So everyone was immediately on the defensive and locked into a near-stalemate. The best hope for a union really lies with the Argonians, who are the only ones who have cleared themselves of gates. Why they didn't leap out to help others I couldn't say. They may not have had enough time, or may not have even wanted to (which I think is fair to say in the case of Morrowind).
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Sept 9, 2014 22:54:38 GMT -5
I suppose, the thing that I find to be the most difficult to believe is that you, as the player character, are the one that makes all the difference and how everyone is otherwise helpless.
Maybe it's just confirmation bias, but... In the Fallout games, it feels that you are really not doing all that much of anything most of the time. It's enough to make a big difference by shifting things in the right direction at the right time with out TES' "only you can do something about this and without you and you alone, everyone else is only capable of faffing about" deal.
I mean, I know it's a game and all, but... Being specifically a ROLE PLAYING game, it becomes difficult to believe that at no point during his adventures, did the protagonist ever wonder "So... Why am I even bothering?", since him saving a group of Ood will literally contribute to everyone else's lives much more, since, at least those can follow orders...while the NPCs in the TES games are only capable of either fucking things up or sitting around in their pants, eating Kit Kats.
Edit: I have no idea what I had originally said, but since it's gone...well...whatever.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Sept 17, 2014 19:55:55 GMT -5
Well, the NPCs are getting better. At least, I think that they are, it's been a bit since I played Skyrim, so it's hard to say for certain at this moment.
As to why the player character has to do it; s/he's The Chosen One. Granted magical abilities to grow, change, and shift to fit into the Prophecy's needs. I guess in a sense you can think of it as an almost god-like entity powering making it so that the player-character is pliable enough to fulfill its needs. In certain instances it's hinted at that the player does it simply because it's the right thing to do as well.
For example a quote of The Chosen One article on TV Tropes: "Morrowind is probably one of the only stories to combine this trope with The Unchosen One — at the end of the game you get asked if you are Nerevar reborn. It is entirely possible to answer that no, you aren't, you're doing this because it's the right thing to do (it is given more weight if you didn't fulfil the entire prophetic list of things you are supposed to do before confronting Dagoth Ur yet still is in a position to confront him by your possession of Kagrenac's Tools attuned to you)."
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Dec 11, 2014 18:24:43 GMT -5
Great googlymoogly I've missed my Scrap Heap! Quick, someone start scrapping with me!
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Dec 14, 2014 3:49:05 GMT -5
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Dec 14, 2014 22:09:00 GMT -5
HUZZAH!
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Feb 8, 2015 16:17:49 GMT -5
Damn. In the TBNC Anime group on Facebook, a conversation broke out about songs that give you the feels and make you want to tear up...and now, I'm stuck listening to a single track with all the feels.
Edit: Oops. Posted the instrumental version on accident....though, I do personally prefer the instrumental version.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Feb 14, 2015 2:32:12 GMT -5
I don't know why, but every time I scroll over that the Nazi heavy soldier from Metro Last Light Redux comes to mind. Every. Time.
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Jun 25, 2015 1:25:44 GMT -5
I still need to play Last Light. I really should.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jul 1, 2015 4:40:57 GMT -5
Yes, you should. 'Tis awesome
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Jul 1, 2015 10:11:59 GMT -5
Much like you should play Human Revolution ;D
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jul 3, 2015 20:10:01 GMT -5
I have been playing it O.o
Did you not get my message about some funky graphics and hacking not acknowledging our commands?
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Jul 5, 2015 11:22:43 GMT -5
Good n_n
And, I'm reasonably sure that I've encountered the hacking mini-game glitches as well. I know that there were times when I'd use a power-up without intending to or would somehow not hack a node that I had said to hack.
Still, despite that, and despite the intro being not particularly indicative of the rest of the game (though, it made narrative sense for me, since Jensen wasn't the aug-boss until after the intro), I think the game is fantastic if played like the original was intended to be played. Hell, it even has the end conditions that you're not told about that the original game had. Let me know once you get past the shipping containers area. You'll know what I mean when you get there. I have an awesome story for you.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jul 5, 2015 13:08:22 GMT -5
Perhaps you should tell Kasanna the story, she's now in "new game+".
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Post by ch00beh on Dec 31, 2015 4:29:08 GMT -5
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Post by ch00beh on Dec 31, 2015 4:29:24 GMT -5
wow literally the wurst
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Jan 5, 2016 0:15:39 GMT -5
Which kind of wurst?
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Aug 28, 2017 23:56:13 GMT -5
The delicious kind, presumably.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Aug 30, 2017 2:49:06 GMT -5
I find that highly doubtful
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Post by Shrouded Wolf on Aug 30, 2017 23:28:27 GMT -5
Okay, I'm feeling baffled. What's with the img tags? I've tried re-hosting the image on three different sites outside of my Dropbox and all I get is a broken image.
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Post by {WW}BetaBloodWolf7 on Sept 1, 2017 1:52:39 GMT -5
I see no such problem >.>
Golly, I wonder what happened!
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